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Post by joakim on Mar 28, 2017 12:03:47 GMT
You dont need 3 imp crits, just imp crit kama and unarmed. And yes you can die from wof which is why wisdom is important. But Jon, isn't imp crit counted as one of the puissant feats for greater damage? Otherwise it's ofcourse better to take Great fortitude or Will instead pre epic. Edit: According to gniht's guide it is, even tho the effect is small. If they come in pairs, and Kama isn't considered a focus weapon for puissant (because we don't want that), u should still need the pairs in other weapons which are considered focused, namely unarmed strike and morningstars in Mr.butchers case. Please correct me if I'm wrong. weapon focus 1/2 improved critical 1/2weapon specialization 2/4 epic weapon focus 2/4 epic weapon specialization 3/6 weapon of choice 3/6 overwhelming critical 3/6
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Post by mcbutcher on Mar 28, 2017 12:14:38 GMT
Also I might be blind but I dont see weapon finesse anywhere. Air elly has high dex.. you're right, I had Finesse in there on the original build, damn it, I'll have to check that out when I go home but as far as I am aware I was able to fit all those pre-epic feats I have there in and finesse as well
does everything else look ok to you?
Aha, found it, I had extend spell in twice
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Post by mdpn22 on Mar 28, 2017 12:27:30 GMT
why dont any of the veteran post a build for him? =)
P.S.: yeah i do agree with give the statment: dont give the man a fish, teach him how to fish.
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Post by joakim on Mar 28, 2017 13:33:37 GMT
why dont any of the veteran post a build for him? =) P.S.: yeah i do agree with give the statment: dont give the man a fish, teach him how to fish. I'm not a veteran, but he now has more than enough knowledge on how to build it. A lot more than I had anyway. Nobody posted any help what so ever in my original post about a build like this. Btw, agreeing with the statement above and writing what u just did is kind of a contradiction isn't it?
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Post by mdpn22 on Mar 28, 2017 13:52:24 GMT
why dont any of the veteran post a build for him? =) P.S.: yeah i do agree with give the statment: dont give the man a fish, teach him how to fish. I'm not a veteran, but he now has more than enough knowledge on how to build it. A lot more than I had anyway. Nobody posted any help what so ever in my original post about a build like this. Btw, agreeing with the statement above and writing what u just did is kind of a contradiction isn't it? Life itself is a contradiction isn´t it? And, there is more then one way to teach someone to fish, he maybe need to know what a fish is
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Post by heavymetal2000 on Mar 28, 2017 13:59:25 GMT
From what I remember monk ac shifted is +1/3 lvls rounded up so your capped at 3 maybe 4 depending on the round up formula.
For puissant you should only need two imp crit but one should be kama if that's your intended weapon.
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Post by mcbutcher on Mar 28, 2017 14:00:34 GMT
why dont any of the veteran post a build for him? =) P.S.: yeah i do agree with give the statment: dont give the man a fish, teach him how to fish. thanks mate, but I actually wanted to have a bash at it myself. I got some helpful replies from all the guys, I just don't have enough knowledge of building characters myself.
I think I have it now though
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Post by joakim on Mar 28, 2017 14:23:25 GMT
From what I remember monk ac shifted is +1/3 lvls rounded up so your capped at 3 maybe 4 depending on the round up formula. For puissant you should only need two imp crit but one should be kama if that's your intended weapon. But how does that go together with what gniht wrote in the puissant guide. U need focus in two weapons, and preferably take as many of "those" feats (ws, ic, ws, ewf and ews), the "third" weapon however, should not be considered to be focused, and that weapon is Kama. Again, Kama should not be considered a focused weapon. That being said, you may be correct. It might be that you can take only improved critical in the weapon you want to use, without it being considered focused. But if it's not, how can the Imp crit then ADD to the puissant dmg for Focused weapons, which is how guide suggest. The more feats u have in your two focused weapons, the higher the puissant added damage will be.
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Post by heavymetal2000 on Mar 28, 2017 14:47:18 GMT
what's this about unfocused puissant?
unfocused puissant is a bit like a "power attack" version of the widget. you still take most of the same feats, but you take them in weapons you don't intend to use as your primary mode of offense in the end. the one exception is that one of your two improved critical feats needs to be in the weapon you intend to use later. that's all there is to it! this version doubles the ab/damage values of the puissant buff, up to a maximum of +4 ab/eb as compared to the standard "focused" variant which caps at +2 ab/eb, so as you can see if you're missing weapon focus and epic weapon focus, you're going to be at lower ab overall with unfocused, but higher damage. i do not generally recommend unfocused variants for builds that have access to epic specialization feats unless you're making a weaponmaster...
As long as the only feat you have for kama is imp crit it will remain unfocused.
The exception would be weapon master where you need to have WF in order to select WoC.
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Post by donojono on Mar 28, 2017 16:16:41 GMT
I don't get it myself does the air ele use a kama ? if so can you take IC kama and forget the focus and get the unfocused bonus and still take two other weapon focuses etc ? is that right Does any of them got to be unarmed? is the Air ele use an unarmed attack or a Kama for the purpose of the attack.
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Post by mdpn22 on Mar 28, 2017 16:23:42 GMT
why go for EDR? arent this type of builds better with ac?
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Post by sidiuqil on Mar 28, 2017 16:59:02 GMT
Quoted from a thread about 5 below this one 😜
"You will need wf, ws, ewf, ews, and ic on 2 weapons for the puissant widget, so I'd put all of those in unarmed for the first weapon and all but ic of the rest of those feats on the second weapon into whatever other weapon you want but if you take ic kama on a monk level pre epic then you won't need the exotic feat. Kama uses unarmed feats for ab bonuses on air elemental since 3t doesn't have any other kama's, so the unarmed feats work for all the elemental and animal shapes.
As a shifter your equipped weapon doesn't really matter, use any 1 hander and a shield and you're solid"
Best explanation i've seen so far.
Afaik ac is better than dr for air/water ele builds, can reach mid 80's ac with decent gear.
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Post by adamantite on Mar 28, 2017 17:08:59 GMT
why go for EDR? arent this type of builds better with ac? None of the elementals have open physical stats so you don't need to pump Dex for ac. Why not push con to 21 and get edr3? That way you can have ac & dr? Unless you have some wild ideas for your 10 epic feats that you can't spare 3 for edr feats it seems a no brainer.
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Post by joakim on Mar 28, 2017 17:57:34 GMT
what's this about unfocused puissant? unfocused puissant is a bit like a "power attack" version of the widget. you still take most of the same feats, but you take them in weapons you don't intend to use as your primary mode of offense in the end. the one exception is that one of your two improved critical feats needs to be in the weapon you intend to use later. that's all there is to it! this version doubles the ab/damage values of the puissant buff, up to a maximum of +4 ab/eb as compared to the standard "focused" variant which caps at +2 ab/eb, so as you can see if you're missing weapon focus and epic weapon focus, you're going to be at lower ab overall with unfocused, but higher damage. i do not generally recommend unfocused variants for builds that have access to epic specialization feats unless you're making a weaponmaster... As long as the only feat you have for kama is imp crit it will remain unfocused. The exception would be weapon master where you need to have WF in order to select WoC. Ok, crystal now, and a bit illogcal still.
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Post by joakim on Mar 28, 2017 18:03:50 GMT
I don't get it myself does the air ele use a kama ? if so can you take IC kama and forget the focus and get the unfocused bonus and still take two other weapon focuses etc ? is that right Does any of them got to be unarmed? is the Air ele use an unarmed attack or a Kama for the purpose of the attack. That's exactly what's weird about it. Only the Air elemental has Kama. And since u'll be using that the most (cuz of hit's high dex combined with you taking finesse), that's the one that will have the highest AB. Also, there is apparantly as I think I wrote earlier, a bug that doesn't let you Attack with fulll AB on the hasted attack on ANY of the other elementals. The other elementals are unarmed yes. And yes, that is apparantly how u need to do it, which i find confusing. U can take one of the two IC on kama, and still be considered having taken 2 focused weapons, when u don't take IC in one of two weapons are focusing on. It's "imo" totally illogical and confusing for somebody who didn't get into the nitty gritty of it like we just did. That being said, i obviously didn't read gniht's post slowly enough to see this.
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